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We Who Thirst
Delve into the captivating tales of women from the Bible, exploring their lives within ancient cultures and historical contexts. These narratives reveal not only their stories but also the profound love and beauty of the God we worship.
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We Who Thirst
Proverbs 31: Rest and Balance
Exploring rest through the lens of Proverbs 31 uncovers a refreshing perspective on productivity and its impact on women’s lives. This episode emphasizes the importance of taking time off, grounding the discussion in historical context, and challenging the cultural narratives around women's work.
• Discussion on exhaustion and shared motherhood experiences
• Connection between Proverbs 31 and societal demands on women
• Cultural perceptions of diligence linked with productivity
• Examination of verses 15 and 18 in context
• Insights on the importance of enforced rest through historical practices
• Summary of Sabbath as a divinely instituted necessity
• Advice on recalibrating personal rest and expectations
• Emphasis on God's delight in women's rest as a sacred gift
Download the Rest Rate Worksheet by visiting: https://wewhothirst.com/product/rest-rate-worksheet/
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Welcome back as we continue through our Proverbs 31 series, looking at the woman of valor and how God delights in women. With me today is my good friend, elise Kilco. She is a foreign worker, volunteer and very busy mom of two little ones. Elise, tell me, are you as exhausted as I am? Absolutely? Are you as exhausted as I am? Absolutely? I feel like life right now is either like exploding or complete collapse. Exhaustion there's like no middle ground.
Speaker 2:No, no middle ground. My kids have been sick. We've had travel. We had a trip in the last month. My kids have been sick. They've missed childcare. I've been sick. Everybody's had a trip in the last month. My kids have been sick. They've missed childcare. I've been sick. Everybody's had a cold and fevers. And yeah, we're tired.
Speaker 1:Yeah. So as we talk about Proverbs 31, have you ever seen people connect the adage a woman's work is never done with Proverbs 31?
Speaker 2:Because today we're going to talk about Proverbs 31 and rest and her relationship to work. I don't know that I've ever seen that specific adage connected with Proverbs 31, but definitely that thought, definitely the thought that you know the woman's life is a cycle and she's never done for the day. It's just a you know a rotation of tasks that have to be done and that she should, you know, be up early, stay up late to get everything done. Everything rests on her. You know, if, if mama's happy, everybody's happy, if mama's not happy, nobody's happy. You know just the thought that, like, the wellness of the house depends on her and it's a lot of pressure if the wellness of her house depends on her.
Speaker 1:Absolutely. When I was researching Proverbs 31 originally, almost every book or blog I looked at was like oh, the Proverbs 31 woman is so diligent, she works so hard and you can tell because she doesn't sleep. She's like up late and up early at the same time, and every single source that was like your common teaching, not a scholarly source, a source directed at women and moms. Moms talked about the Proverbs 31 woman as somebody who's just like superhero in her energy up late, up early, always working. That's the vibe that everybody portrayed her as. Have you heard that emphasis specifically, which is not sustainable, though. Have you heard that emphasis?
Speaker 2:Yes, absolutely yeah, it's very much. It definitely sets you up for a lot of failure because it isn't sustainable. You know it works for a weekend, or you know you can push through it for for an event or for a season, even if you, you know, have the wherewithal, but at some point it's a house of cards and it will all come crashing down. So what happens to you know? What can we do to not make it crash down Like it's not sustainable? So Proverbs 31 hopefully has a lot to tell us about. Rest.
Speaker 1:It does, but indirectly. And I really want to focus on the cultural elements and help us reframe how we look at these typical verses about her staying up late and getting up early, because people read those and I think they assume one thing when the text isn't actually saying what they are assuming. But the idea is that she's doing everything and that she's working all hours. Comes from Proverbs 31, 15, and 18. So, elise, while you turn there, I just want to briefly address the her doing everything idea.
Speaker 1:We're not going to talk about that a lot, but if you're just tuning into this episode, the last two episodes, we talked about the Proverbs 31 woman's home and her business. So if you haven't listened to those yet, go back, because we address did the Proverbs 31 woman's home and her business. So if you haven't listened to those yet, go back, because we address did the Proverbs 31 woman do everything? Was she good at everything? That question we address very much in the episodes on her home and her businesses. So go back for that idea. But for the idea that she's working all the time, not sleeping up late, up early, let's look at Proverbs 31, 15, and 18. Will you read those for me?
Speaker 2:Yes, absolutely so. Proverbs 31, 15 says she rises while it is still night and provides food for her household, and verse 18 says she sees that her prophets are good and her lamp never goes out at night.
Speaker 1:Okay, We'll talk about each of those in turn. Let's start with the whole. She rises while it's still night. I have seen that used as kind of like parallel to Benjamin's Franklin early to bed, early to rise makes a man healthy, wealthy and wise kind of idea. Or it's paired with the oh, Christian mama, you want to spend time with Jesus or get some time to yourself? Get up before your children every day. You just need to get up earlier is the advice I heard all the time when I was a young mom. Did you hear stuff like that?
Speaker 2:Yes, so much yes, yeah, yeah, and I know neither. Before my kids. Oh yeah, then the rest of the day would go well.
Speaker 1:Right, and I know neither of us neither you or I are morning people really to begin with. And then, god, I think your kids sleep. At least they sleep in better than mine. One of my children has never consistently slept later than 5 am Ever in child's entire life. Frequently, at one point that child was up five or six times a night and was waking up for the day at 4.45 am. So I'm a young mom drowning and people are like just get up before your kids and I'm like when. Three in the morning? No, so let's talk about the Proverbs. 31 woman in her context.
Speaker 1:So today is February 13th when we're recording this. So sunrise in Jerusalem. I'm going to get technical on details because it matters. Sunrise in Jerusalem. I'm going to get technical on details because it matters. Sunrise in Jerusalem. This week is approximately 625, 630-ish.
Speaker 1:It's winter in the northern hemisphere and so our days are getting longer, but slowly. In Austin where I live, austin, texas, sunrise is about 715 am. So days where I sub at my local public school, I get up at 5.40 in the morning. Normal days for me, because of my husband's work schedule and getting the kids to school, I get up at 6 am. So this time of year I'm waking up at least an hour to an hour and a half before the sun comes up, with that much night left.
Speaker 1:So people utilize Proverbs 31, 15,. She rises while it's still night to say people need to get up early. But most people I know are already getting up before the sun every day, which is a lot. It is a lot, but it's also just it's life. It's not like this is something spectacular, it's just what you do ordinary every day. Yeah, we just get up before the sun and it's easy to do that with electricity.
Speaker 1:Um, maybe less so. Then her being able to get up and be productive while it's still dark outside means she has access to light in her house, which again, as we've talked about, denotes privilege and wealth. So I mentioned all this just to show the point that the majority of the year, the working person, man or woman, gets up while it's still dark. So the statement that she rises while it's still night is already a reality for the morning of day, shift working people everywhere. Yeah, that's important. It's not a, it's not the oh, just get up before your kids, kids. It's what people are doing out of necessity and it's normal life for a lot of people. Can you read verse 18 for us again?
Speaker 2:yes, verse 18 says she sees that her profits are good and her lamp never goes out at night, and we talked a lot about this verse last when we talked about her businesses. So how does it relate to rest?
Speaker 1:Well, just to review for those who may not remember the lamp going out at night is less of a statement of her diligence, which is how it's generally been interpreted, and more of a statement of her wealth, that she has the resources to burn her lamp at night. There's an old proverb that said poor people don't have lamps at night because they can't afford to burn olive oil all night. The woman of valor can burn olive oil all night, and we see that also in verse 18, because it's saying can burn olive oil all night. And we see that also in verse 18 because it's saying she has success in her businesses, so her lamp doesn't go out at night. Her business success is directly related to the lamp. It's not that she has to work super hard to try to make ends meet so she stays up late. No, it's that she is successful. She has literal cash to burn in her lamps.
Speaker 2:So she it's a matter of privilege, then. In this case, it's a matter of privilege.
Speaker 1:But I also really want to reinterpret these verses. Considering a lack of electricity, we take electricity for granted and don't think about how bound to the sun the ancient cultures were. Because my work hours the sun really doesn't impact my work hours at all. My work hours are dictated by a clock, not the sun, because if the sun's down I just turn on an electric lamp and I still have plenty of light to see. So the woman of valor had the privilege of getting up before the sun if she chose. But even then you can't do that much with oil lamp light. Have you ever tried to get work done by candlelight? That's, all you have is candles or a little oil lamp in your house.
Speaker 2:Yes, as a matter of fact I have, when I was teaching in the jungle and they let go out. Trying to do lesson plans by candlelight is a challenge. If the wind combines and blows your your candles out, then thank God for flashlights.
Speaker 1:Right, and hopefully you have enough batteries a large loom you're trying to work with to do weaving, how easy would that be to do with like a little oil lamp or a candle, because you're not just like a candle set right next to your paper where you can see you're trying to work on this very, very fine project. That's quite large with not very much light coming in. Yeah, that would be really hard in?
Speaker 1:Yeah, that would be really hard. So even the Proverbs 31 woman is bound by the sun, and some of these cultures did a lot of their weaving outdoors. They have archaeological remains of looms that were staked to the ground outside, and so it's not even necessarily an indoor activity. It's an outdoor activity, and when the sun goes down, bye-bye, we're done with work for the day, and the poor women couldn't afford to keep lamps burning. They had to wait on the sun, which meant a poor woman, a regular peasant woman's opportunity for productive labor was diminished, not because she wasn't as diligent or as hard working as the woman of valor, but because she wasn't as privileged as the woman of valor she was bound by the sun, yeah, by the daylight hours.
Speaker 2:She had. Yeah, and that was that's all she had which would be what in in israel at this time.
Speaker 1:So um, using our standardized time today in the ancient world, they would just adjust their internal clocks to whatever the sun was doing. They didn't have time. Like we did, their time, daily time, like we see in the Bible, like especially in the New Testament. They talk about like the first, the sixth hour of the day. They literally went off when the sunrise. They didn't have arbitrary time. But if we use our arbitrary time on the shortest days of the year, the sun sets at 4.40 in the afternoon in Jerusalem and 5.30 in Austin. I'm just using Jerusalem and Austin as our two benchmarks here. So the shortest day of the year, the sun is up at 630 in Jerusalem and down at 440 in Jerusalem, which means they have 10 hours of daylight. That's it, wow.
Speaker 2:On the shortest day of the year, no.
Speaker 1:On the longest day of the year, jerusalem actually gets like 13 minutes more daylight than Austin does I discovered minutes more daylight than Austin does I discovered. But on the longest day of the year, both places get about 14 hours. Okay, when I polled my followers on Instagram, I found that most of us today are awake doing something. We might be working, we might be watching Netflix, but we are awake doing something for at least 16 hours a day. Wow, that's a big difference. Yeah, so winter, the Proverbs 31 woman had 10 hours of daylight to work with. Summer, when you had on, like the summer solstice, she had 14 max, and so when we are thinking about her staying up late or getting up early, that means she might get the 16 hours that we do every day.
Speaker 2:So this doesn't sound like somebody that's burning the candle at both ends, like this doesn't sound. So how does that relate? Tell us more about this, then.
Speaker 1:So when we're talking about length of days, that puts definite limits on how much she could work and it also creates enforced rest. She had to do something restful. She might be able to sit by the fire and talk with people while she's spinning or doing something kind of like me crocheting while I watch TV at night. You know they might do that in the evening but they can't work. They're enforced by the sun. Work is over because there is no light. All you can do is sit and maybe spin, because that's just like tactile, you don't have to see as much. So the sun really enforced static rest hours and it's seasonal. Some seasons they're going to be working more than others and that's one thing we don't have. Our seasons don't necessarily dictate our work patterns like theirs did.
Speaker 1:But also, god gave his people Israel Sabbath and this gift of Sabbath was another area where God actually codified it into law that they had to rest. There wasn't for the average Hebrew person in the Old Testament religious observance they had to do on the Sabbath. By the New Testament times people were going to synagogue. A priest might have some sacrifices to do at the temple, but the average person has no special religious observance to do on Sabbath. The way they observe Sabbath is by being idle, by not doing anything, and this was mandated by the law. So God, through the natural rhythms of the sun and by giving them Sabbath, put a huge amount of rest into the daily life of the Hebrew people of the Old Testament, which would impact the Proverbs 31, woman, and how much she works.
Speaker 2:That sounds amazing. I would like Sabbath this way, right? So when we're talking about Sabbath, you talked about how Sabbath is enforced in the Bible. We see that very clearly. What did other cultures in the ancient Near East do? How did their weeks or calendars work?
Speaker 1:So that's a great question. Most calendars in the ancient Near East were lunar calendars to determine the months. So they decided the months by the waning and growing of the moon, combined with a solar calendar to determine the year. So they're like lunar solar calendars. But the idea of a seven-day week was actually fairly rare in the cultures of the ancient Near East. The cultures that did have the idea of week which not every culture did they had months and year and seasons, but not necessarily the week, and they had days obviously. But the cultures that did have the idea of a week, it wasn't always seven days, like ancient Egypt had a 10 week. The Romans had an eight day week. Ancient Germans and Assyrians had, like five day weeks oh, interesting. So they would split their month up into these kind of week-like periods, but they were not necessarily seven days.
Speaker 1:The Akkadians, who lived slightly before Abraham's time and he may have even been in their territory, ur and all of that and Haran they, slightly before Abraham's time, created a system of seven day weeks and the Babylonians divided their months into seven day periods marked by an evil day at the end of each of the seven days. They had an eight day week. They had a seven day. The seventh day was the evil day. Oh, okay, um, but the evil day wasn't like a sabbath, it wasn't a rest day, it was just a day you couldn't do certain activities because of superstition. Um, they did have like one mandated rest day. The babylonians instituted, um during the maybe two, like on the 15th or 20th of the month, related to the cycle of the moon. Like the moon has disappeared, it's resting, so we're going to take a day off, but it was just like one day. They did have five or six holidays every month, but those holidays didn't necessarily mean they got a break from work. There's just some sort of religious thing going on that may or may not impact the average person.
Speaker 1:So from my brief research, the consensus is that Egypt seemed to have a little bit of a weekend, at least at one period. Little bit of a weekend, at least at one period. Um, they seem to have a two-day weekend at the end of their 10-day weeks for at least the royal craftsmen and artisans. That didn't necessarily impact women, slaves, the average person, but at least some of the mucky mucks got a weekend every 10-day week. They're the one culture who kind of had that idea. But other than that the ancient Near East didn't seem to have any concept of Sabbath that applied to the entire population. The Romans actually ridiculed the Jewish people for being idle one day of the week. They're like you are lazy slobs for taking one day a week for a Sabbath. So this is an idea that was very foreign to the ancient Near East, but it is an idea that God instituted in the Bible, this one out of seven rest day, and it applied from top to bottom the king to the slave, to the cow, to the horse. Everybody was supposed to rest.
Speaker 2:It's so interesting how radical this is when you understand what the rest of the ancient Near East was doing. It really is radical what God was asking Israel to do.
Speaker 1:Mm. Hmm, it really was, because there had to be so much faith. And we see that with the manna where he's like on the sixth day you pick up twice as much manna because there will be some leftover for the seventh day and some people didn't believe. So they go out on the seventh day and there's no food. God's like. I told you to pick up twice as much Because we do have that adage. A woman's work is never done and throughout history women have often been in charge of the daily repetitive tasks to which there is really no end. You always have dishes and laundry and cooking and grinding and weaving and all the things. Those are just all the time things Planting and harvesting. You have set times of year and then you're done. But women's work is this repetitive all the time work. And God was like for six days. You have your repetitive all the time work and then one day you're done.
Speaker 2:You have to nurse your baby, you know you have to parent your children, you have to feed your animals.
Speaker 1:Yep, but you're not doing that. Anything extra, anything extra, that, anything extra, anything extra. And so God really surrounded his people in the Old Testament with rest, and it's really incredible how much rest he actually, either through the created order or through the Mosaic law, gave his people.
Speaker 2:So how much rest then? Do you figure people in the Bible are getting using our time, and what we can tell from the ancient Near East and the laws that God gave for Sabbath I?
Speaker 1:love this question. So a while back I'm backtracking, then I'm going to answer your question. A while back I read an article and you can find the note to that in the show notes. I read an article that said your average healthy, neurotypical, non-traumatized person needs a 42% rest rate. Which that rest rate would include sleep, exercise, eating, meals, personal hygiene, leisure, etc. Just all of that stuff hygiene, leisure, etc. Just all of that stuff 42% of their time they need to spend in some sort of rest to keep themselves from moving into burnout.
Speaker 1:And that is for your neurotypical, non-traumatized, average, healthy person 42%. So I decided I was like, oh, that's really fascinating. 42%. That seems high. But I want to think about this. So I sat down and I did all the math to look at Israel and see how much rest did God give Israel throughout a year. So if I average the entire year for Israel, with the sun and with Sabbath hours, yep, daylight hours and Sabbath, not including extra holidays where they had to rest I didn't feel like figuring those out, so just Sabbath and daylight, Israel's average rest rate was 57%.
Speaker 1:That's incredible. So modern science is like 42% rest rate to keep yourself from burnout. God is like average over a year 57% rest rate the shortest or the longest days of the year. So middle of summer, when you might be doing your most harvesting and stuff, the people of Israel might have gotten maybe a 50% rest rate during the longest days of the year, but that is the minimum that God gave his people 50%, which is 8% higher than science said. And then on the shortest days of the year, the rest rate for Israel goes up to about 64%. Of their time they were resting of some kind, assuming even if they're awake, they're doing more leisure type activities whittling, spinning, talking, sharing stories around the fire in the evening before they go to bed. And so, rather than the woman of valor being an example of capitalistic productivity, when we logically think through the ramifications of daily life in a pre-industrialized society dictated by the Mosaic law, she's actually an example of rest for us.
Speaker 2:Incredible. Not what is usually taught when we think about Proverbs 31.
Speaker 1:Yeah, and I love that the authors talk about people leaving 42%. God is like bet, I'm going to make it a minimum of average, 57, easy, and I just think that is so cool easy and I just think that is so cool.
Speaker 2:So how can we tell if we're getting enough rest, or even what our rest looks like.
Speaker 1:Yeah, because I'm sure we're like, hey, what's my rest rate? What's normal? Yeah, yeah. So I actually made and you can get this on my website. Look at the show notes and I have the link and everything for you there. I made a rest rate worksheet. It's not perfect, but it at least helps us think through what rest percentage am I at right now and where might I need to shift some stuff in life around to increase that rate, because I think the hard data can help us see. Oh yeah, this is why I'm tired all the time, because my rest rate is really low and I need to make a focus on raising that.
Speaker 2:Yeah. So you sent me this worksheet and I have it like half filled out and my husband's going to fill it out and I'm excited because I think it will really help my husband and I to talk through how we can better use our time wisely so that we're both getting better rest. So I'm really excited about your worksheet because my rest rate is not good.
Speaker 1:So what is your rest rate? Talking about 42% being standard and God having a minimum of 50%, what is yours?
Speaker 2:I'm at like 37. So I'm like on the highest of burnout.
Speaker 1:You're headed for burnout. I'm not doing good. That's fair and that is great to recognize, because none of this is like a static. You have to be at 42 or 50% or you're in sin, like I've. I had some people test out this out and they were really worried because they were in the 30s and I'm like it's not a sin issue, you know you're not bad, but it does let you know. Oh, I may need to restructure some things in life. I need to sit down and have a conversation with my husband. I need to think, maybe, how I can just get a few more hours to rest, because sometimes, with different seasons, you just can't find more rest time. But maybe I can eke out two hours even though I can't get 20%.
Speaker 2:I think it's such a really. I think it will really be a helpful tool to help figure out you know how to better use what time we have. You know even just those extra couple of minutes per day, if you have a couple extra minutes per day. Or figuring out how to restructure. You know the women of valor got takeout. You know she bought the bread, so that's what it takes you know Exactly.
Speaker 1:Oh, I love that. Yeah, and I have noticed in my own life I think right now I am somewhere and I purposely gave myself a swath because it can vary week to week I'm typically somewhere between 48 and 57% rest rate right now and my husband and I work hard to prioritize rest and mine is slightly lower because I'm purposely working a few more hours. Right now I have some contract projects and other things I'm doing that I need to focus on and I love that and in some ways, some of that work it's kind of restful but I don't count it as rest, but I can also tell that I'm doing that.
Speaker 1:I need to focus on and I love that and in some ways some of that work. It's kind of restful, but I don't count it as rest. But I can also tell that I'm running. I'm running about my minimum, like I know. If I get lower than 48 to 57% I'm headed for burnout so quickly. And when I get to burnout I'm going to be like I'll get the bare minimum done and then have to rest the rest of the time.
Speaker 2:So safeguarding yourself from getting to burnout is helpful in the end, not letting yourself get there to begin with.
Speaker 1:And that's one way I feel like this rest worksheet is helpful, because you know, you are looking at your rest rate and you're like, oh, I'm in the 30s, this might not be good. I've been struggling with X, y and Z and maybe some of that is because I'm not getting the rest I need, and so you're looking at what are some concrete things I can do to change that. Yeah, so one other thing I think is really important, because science talks about the 42% rate for the non-traumatized, neurotypical, healthy person. And one thing I put on my rest worksheet that I want, I think is important to consider, because during one season of life you may find, hey, I can rock it out at a 45% rest rate and I'm just going, I'm flying. I should sit down and calculate what my rest rate was when I was single in seminary versus what I needed to be as a mom.
Speaker 2:I was just going to say that. I was going to say that as a single person. What did I do? Because it's drastically different.
Speaker 1:It's drastically different and I have a page on the rest worksheet that says that. That walks you through. Considering some life factors like is there neurodivergent? Are you neurodivergent? Do you have mental health struggles? Do you have a history of trauma or disability or chronic illness? Are you a parent of somebody with those things? Are you a spouse of someone with those things? Do you lack a support system? Are you caregiving small children or the sick or the elderly? And those things will make your baseline rest needs go up.
Speaker 2:That's so important to recognize.
Speaker 1:Or seasonal stressors pregnancy, death, divorce, estrangement, moving, new community sickness. Maybe you're just in a month where everybody's sick all the time. You're going to need to take that and be like, okay, normally I can do great with 50% rest, but my kids have been sick for six weeks, so maybe I should make a goal to bump up to maybe 60% rest this week. And the rest rates I calculate over a week, not daily, cause, like I rest a lot more on the weekend than I do during the weekdays, that makes sense. But I really wanted to include those life factors and seasonal stressors into this, not that they give us exact numbers, but just to help us be aware of wow, I'm at, you know, 40 to 60% on the chart.
Speaker 1:That seems like it should be a good amount of rest. That's what God gave Israel. But when you start considering all of the massive life factors many of us are carrying, we actually need more rest than this. I sat down with a friend who is neurodivergent, with a massive history of trauma, who has kids with massive trauma and neurodivergence. Yeah, yeah, rest guilt-free 80% of the time and then 20% of the time you will hopefully have the energy you're looking for to do the work you want to be doing, but you can take all of those things into consideration and you're not beating yourself up because you need a 60, 70, 80% rest rate. You're giving your body what it needs for the things God's allowed in your life and then, when you do have energy, you can work hard as unto the Lord within a reasonable timeframe, rather than needing an 80% rest rate or a 60% rest rate but trying to function with only a 40% rest rate and just making everything worse.
Speaker 2:That's so important and throughout, like this whole podcast, we've been talking about how Proverbs 31, as it's usually taught put so much pressure on us women, and I think that when hearing you talk about rest and the Proverbs 31 woman and everything that Proverbs 31 has to teach us about rest, this is another area where we can see God's plan taking that pressure off, which is wonderful. It's so helpful.
Speaker 1:Yeah, no, God's plan for women is restful. Jesus says come to me, you who are weary and heavy laden, and I will give you rest. That is what Jesus offers. He is not offering the yoke of get up early, stay up late, work, work, work. It's your job to manage all of your family's physical, emotional, spiritual, et cetera needs by yourself, because you're the woman and you have to help. That's not what's going on.
Speaker 1:God orchestrated for women a 50% rest rate minimum. And that was unheard of in the ancient culture. Even cultures that did have days off, it didn't necessarily consider women or slaves. Yeah, that's incredible. And so everyone listening. I just really want to drive home God values you resting. Even the early church fathers and I'm kind of irritated with them about this, as they tried to separate the Christian Sabbath or Sunday worship from the Jewish Sabbath they joined the Romans in calling the Jewish people idol. And the early church fathers are like you don't need to take Sunday off, you just have to make sure you make time to worship on Sunday. So in some ways they even were proponents of seven-day work weeks, as long as you worship on Sunday, because it's about your heart and your worship rather than understanding the Old Testament, Sabbath included cessation from labor as central to your religious observance.
Speaker 1:Because, being an important distinction. Because being willing to stop working is a matter of faith, saying God, I can't do it all. I am going to rest because you made me finite and I'm going to trust you with the excess, because you are on your throne, you are ruling, keeping chaos at bay, and I am going to rest even though the dishes and the projects are not done, because you desire rest, and rest is the gift you give your children over and over and over again in your word.
Speaker 2:That's incredible. All right, so we've learned all about what Proverbs 31 has to say about rest, but this isn't necessarily attainable for everyone. So to the person who doesn't have a very good helpful network or maybe they're just in a really hard season of their life where they don't have the privilege to outsource where you know would otherwise be helpful, what can you say to that person about rest? How does rest in Proverbs 31 apply to this person?
Speaker 1:First I just want to acknowledge the hard season in place that they are in. I want to acknowledge and I've been there. I've been there where I have a chronically ill spouse, I have neurodivergent, undiagnosed neurodivergent kids that I don't know what to do with, who are up each multiple times a night, medical bills you can't pay, basically single mom caregiving a chronically ill person, and so I have so much compassion and love for that situation. And first I just want to reemphasize how much rest we get as new covenant Christians is not a moral issue. Does God desire rest for us? Yes, are we sinful? Are we in sin if life will not allow that rest? No, there may be sin for those who are just like I'm not going to rest because I don't need it.
Speaker 1:That's a completely different issue that we're not talking about right now. But for that person, I mean, I don't have, and I don't think there are clear-cut, easy answers If you don't have community and everything is just crashing in. Some seasons are like that, sometimes life is like that, and so my encouragement is to find rest where you can, rest where you can, to lower expectations where you can. For me, I remember when a pastor's wife sat me down and was like girlfriend, you need to make a menu for a couple weeks and just repeat it over and over. Stop reinventing the wheel. Like you don't have to be putting in that much effort on this task. Allowing you know, and maybe you're at the point where you're like I've already lowered the bar. It's on the floor.
Speaker 1:Like it's under the floor and I just want to. I want to say God sees you there, yeah, and being outside the situation, I can't be like A, b, c and D will solve it. It won't. It won't Some of these situations. You don't have a community to step in and watch your kids or help with the caretaking. You don't have, maybe, a spouse who's supportive. You don't have these things. But I trust that you are trying to make the best decisions you can and don't feel guilty when you have moments of rest, even if there's so much that needs to be done because you have so much on your plate. Allow yourself, by faith, to rest when you can, and even if that means like passing out, even if that means like passing out at six o'clock, you know, or sitting and spending three hours binge watching your favorite show, because you're not necessarily ready to go to bed, but you're just done.
Speaker 2:And allow yourself to do, because when you're in that place where there's just so much you can, you can feel guilty for the little bits of rest you have and so really enjoy those moments. Um, what thoughts do you have, elise? I, what comes to mind, um, is something that, um, margaret bronson has actually talked about, and it's something I used to do even before it was pointed out to me, and that's kind of a thought exercise, you know. We know, as believers, that God is with us, jesus is with us, and Margaret talked a lot about reparenting yourself, imagining Jesus with you and whether that's. You know, if you need a father, you know, imagining him as your father and you as a child being one of those children that came and sat on Jesus' knees in a playful, not creepy way, you know, in a playful, not creepy way, you know. Or whether that's needing Jesus as a friend, and imagining him sitting next to you and just having that conversation in your head, allowing yourself to just kind of relax into that. This is someone who loves me and cares for me, and I can relax and allow myself to be. You know, the best friendship is the friendship where the quietness is not awkward, you know, allowing yourself to just sit in that, and so I think, especially in the deep moments of burnout, when we're at the very end of our rope which right now I'm definitely on the tail end of that, hopefully the tail end of that In those moments when I have 15 minutes, while my husband's giving the kids a snack, and I get to go to my quiet, dark bedroom and lay on the bed and just imagining like I can just be here, I don't have to say anything to Jesus, and maybe it's just Jesus I'm tired, yeah, I'm tired, and I don't know what to make for supper.
Speaker 2:But just give me rest. And I think that some of my best naps have been when I have fallen asleep, just really connected to God's presence. And so, even in those really really tiny moments when my heart is breaking or when circumstances are hard, allowing myself to be like Mary of Bethany who sits at Jesus' feet, and it doesn't change a situation After my nap, I still have to get up, I still have to make supper, I still have to take care of screaming kids, but for that 15 minutes or for that 20 minutes, I got to rest, and so I think that that's that's important, that's what I would say, and it's not a huge thing, but it's something that makes a difference.
Speaker 1:And remembering that the demands God places on us are not always the same as what the Christian culture has placed on us. There are so many and they don't mean them necessarily as demands, but like you need to do your devos and pray and do all these things which are good spiritual practices, but to remember that God is offering us rest and he's not making a million demands of us. There's a verse in Isaiah that talks about how God leads the sheep gently. He leads the ewes that are with young. God knows what it's like for the new mom with three other kids who's just trying to hold it all together while her husband works three jobs. He knows what it's like for the caregiver of the chronically ill person who literally cannot take a break because there's no one else to care for this person. God knows and his expectations for the caregiver and the weak and the wounded and the weary are not a checklist of performance-oriented goals. It is literally exactly what you described and I've done that so many times myself Just the I'm going to collapse on this couch and, you know, proverbially put my head in Jesus' lap and fall asleep. Just the comfort of the presence, knowing that I have nothing left and God isn't expecting me, he isn't looking for me to give him anything else. I feel like sometimes what I learned was that God is demanding as much from me as all the people in my life, but he's not. He is offering to us. He's offering His presence, he's offering Himself, he's offering rest and even if we can't get the rest percentage up or the hours of rest, he is offering us a lack of demands coming from him. He is offering himself as a non-demanding presence, which is amazing, which we need so badly especially we're in burnout or caregiver fatigue or any of that to know that God is offering himself as a non-demanding presence where we can just literally collapse and cry or whatever. It's completely beautiful.
Speaker 1:I know there have been so many times, especially last year. I felt like most of last year I was trying to work myself out of burnout and there were so many times I'd be sitting and all I had capacity for was like playing video games on my Switch and feeling guilty that I'm not doing something else and I'm just kind of praying through that as I'm playing and just feeling from the Lord. Just this, jessica, this is my gift to you right now. This is a restful, soothing activity for you to do in a life that is not restful or soothing.
Speaker 1:And I am offering this to you without guilt, without strings attached, and so for the person who's in burnout, or just life, I mean, elise and I would love to stop by your house and like make life stop and give you rest, and we can't, and we pray and long that you would find community to step in and be the hands and feet of Jesus for you. But know, even when you don't have that community, that God is offering himself, not as a trite Jesus is your rest, but he is a non-demanding presence. He's not demanding that you find Jesus to be your rest. And that's where I got hung up Like, oh, I have to find Jesus as my rest, and that became a to-do that was stressful, because am I resting in Jesus?
Speaker 1:I don't know if I'm resting in Jesus, which is different than like he's already there and there's no demands, and he's just like come here, come sleep. I don't need you to pray, I don't need you to read your Bible, I don't need you to do all the things, just you're okay, I got you, you are safe. So that's what I think we would like to offer the people in that situation.
Speaker 2:So we're back to my favorite question. Every week, this is my favorite question what do these passages tell us about rest and how we can apply it to us today? How does God delight in women as regards to rest and Proverbs 31?
Speaker 1:God likes it when women take time off to rest. Mic drop Boom Rather than Proverbs 31, 15, and 18 being like work harder, be more diligent. It is a call for us to examine, because she's not doing anything that we're not already doing. And it's a call for us to examine what is God actually asking us to do? What was the gift he gave Israel? What was the gift he gave women that no one else in the ancient world was giving women? No one. Because even though upper classes may have had certain rest days, the lower classes and the women didn't, and God worked that into his covenant and his promises. God delights in women getting rest.
Speaker 2:That's wonderful.
Speaker 1:He does not delight in women working 24-7, burning themselves out to reach an imaginary standard of good motherhood or good womanhood.
Speaker 2:That's important.
Speaker 1:We are not created to do everything or work nonstop that's important or do what is needed for the good of our bodies, and recognize the part that he plays in sustaining us through all of that. That's so incredible. Well, thank you all for joining us for this conversation on rest. I had so much fun talking about it. Be sure to get the rest worksheet from my website. Send me a DM or an email if you have questions about that. I love talking people through it.
Speaker 1:Next time on the podcast and it's free. Right, it is free. Yes, thank you. Free worksheet. Yes, next time on the podcast, we're going to be talking about the woman of valor, her community and her children, so that will be a really fun conversation. I think Elise and I are planning on talking a little bit about mothering, maybe definitely about community and friendship, and that will be a really fun conversation, so be sure to tune in then. Thank you so much for being with us today. May the Lord bless you and keep you. May his face shine upon you and give you peace. Have a great day.
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